TrigpointingUK

Why do some of the members on here find it acceptable to trespass on private property? They even go to the extreme of climbing on children's toys and breaking them in the process to get to a trig that is NO longer there!! Yes you read it right NO LONGER THERE!! And why it is no longer there is because the OS removed it because of people trespassing, taking images which contained images off children on and placing them on the Internet! More importantly no one has EVER asked us if they can visit the trig.

Trig points are sometimes in people's gardens and on private property this DOES NOT give you the right to trespass so why do you??

Which trig point are you referring to specifically? In my experience, the overwhelming majority of people would not trespass or deviate from an established right-of-way. I absolutely agree that damaging property is unacceptable, as is taking pictures of someone without their consent. I must say, I don't think I have ever seen a picture on this website (or others related to this hobby) containing anyone other than intended. If such a photo is found on this site, it is possible to flag that to the administrators, or contact them directly to have it removed.

It is also possible that whoever is responsible for the damage and trespass you mention may not have been a member of this site.

The pilar is tp4630 the photos were removed, however you will see for yourselves there are photos of our vehicles on the site still! Indicating that we were in!

The pilar was destroyed last year due to these issues and lots of evidence being presented to the os, the is supported our request however it was never our intention to have it destroyed just moved to a more suitable location.

We purchased the property 2 years ago and have undergone a full renovation, it is not on polite but also respectful to ask permission to enter private property. The os do not even have direct right to it without prior approval.

People assume they can just attend the pillars and that surprises me, most people including myself prob would not object but why trespass and potentially cause an issue?

You also state in your reply about most people wouldn't trespass...... Play be you need to read done of the comments on the pilar page for yourself then and then you maybe won't defang people's actions that are wrong.

If these people font stop more trip points will be destroyed!!

The only photo present which shows vehicles or other identifiable info is dated 02/02/2014 - the corresponding log entry does state that permission to visit the pillar was given by a resident. There were no visits logged on this site 24/03/14 (when it was specifically requested to contact the owner re: access) and 27/06/14 (when the pillar was confirmed to be destroyed) - the whole point of this site is to log visits to pillars, note condition, take GPS reading, etc. If someone from this site had visited this pillar during that time, then surely they would have logged it - that's the whole point of this site. That leads me to believe that either a member of this site visited the pillar but did not log it (unlikely), or that a someone not affiliated with this site visited the pillar (more likely).

There have been two logged visits since the removal of the pillar - one of which specifically mentions the pillar was not visited (17/02/15), and the other does not contain any photographs or a GPS reading (02/08/14). I think you'd be hard-pressed to prove that a member of this site trespassed or damaged your property. I understand that you are upset about it, but pointing the finger without any evidence isn't going to solve anything.

I would very much assume that any trig-bagger in England would be fully aware of the laws regarding access and the legal definition of trespass, and the implications of ignoring them.

Erm....... Despite what you say the os had enough evidence to destroy the pilar!
As for the post you refer to stating they asked permission, asked whom as we are the owners and they did NOT ask us so they were trespassing!
You obviously did not read my comments so I suggest you read them before you try and argue a point you clearly know nothing about!
I've pointed out that people should NOT be trespassing or nor trig points will be destroyed because of the actions, you only have to read the comments further down to know that some of the people on the site trespass and do things they shouldn't, well I'm sorry but it is common decency to ask permission and not just assume, and I for one was brought up to USE MY MANNERS after all they were given to us for FREE

I've tried to have a cordial discussion about this with you, but obviously you are more interested in attacking the members of this site, and blaming them for the alleged damage to your property. It could have been anyone, that's the point I was trying to make.

I don't have anything further to say, other than I'm glad that north of the border we don't need to have childish arguments about "trespass" and who can restrict access to certain pockets of land. You have some truly beautiful countryside in England, and it's a shame that more people can't experience it to the fullest because of access restrictions.

I'm not quite sure I understand why this complaint is being directed at TrigpointingUK members. There were only two visits to this trigpoint by T:UK users, between the date you took ownership of the property and the date you arranged for destruction of the trigpoint. On both occasions, the T:UK member makes explicit reference to having gained agreement from a local resident.

So even if you perceive that you have a problem with trespassing, it seems clear that T:UK members are not part of it.

The debate as to whether it's GOMLs or trespassers who are to blame for the gradual destruction of our heritage, will no doubt continue. And I fear that maxkatie is correct that more English landowners will follow the same destructive path that she chose.

However, the Manor Farm destruction clearly demonstrates that destroying trigpoints does not discourage people from visiting. Indeed the experience is that traffic to the site may actually increase, as people pay witness to the destruction. (The Twin Towers are "NO LONGER THERE!!", yet millions still visit them!)

Knowing this, I can only assume that any future destruction of trigpoints by landowners is being carried out as an act of revenge against past trespasses, rather than out of any misguided expectation that the trespassing will stop.

You refer to permission from the landowner being granted by these people!!
I standby everything that I have stated that NO permission has be granted by the landowner so therefor the people are trespassing! If they have not knocked on MY DOOR or SPOKEN TO ME or my HUSBAND then they DO NOT have permission to be on the land. It is common curious to ask to visit so why put yourself in the position of risking trespass.

I refered to visit prior to our purchase which stated to do xu and z because people wouldn't know, because it was a building site etc etc it is still trespass on private land and permission should still be granted.

My point wasn't about specific people, it is about people in general even those that don't log their visits. More sites will be destroyed if this behaviour continues, so why risk it and argue a point that I have a valid point over!!