Server migration / website re-write

[Teasel]

When I first open a trig view there is a large grey box around the trig icon. This disappears when you zoom either -/+ on the map.

Thanks for the feedback! The grey boxes on the trigpoint pages were due to a caching problem, which I have just fixed on the T:UK server and on Cloudflare. However you may need to clear your browser cache before the grey squares disappear. Please let me know if even that does not fix the issue.

[Teasel]

Hi James, thanks for all the feedback!

On the map when displaying the trig points you haven’t logged those logged as “unreachable but visible” are showing on the map as not logged.

Yeah, sorry, the mapping of conditions to colours / icons / buttons is all over the place right now! I'll get it fixed eventually!

Would a search facility be possible (similar to the old site where you could search by type, use, status, logged or not, distance, etc.)? For example, a search that would output all the primaries trig points that the user hasn’t logged ordered by distance from a defined grid reference.

Yes, but I'm not quite sure where this would sit best. We currently have a low-level /search screen which is intended for specific stuff, like finding logs mentioning GOMLs, finding everything containing the text 'ben' etc. And we have a high-level /trigs screen, which is intended for easy slicing and dicing lists of trigpoints. If we expand the /trigs screen to include detailed physical types, historic usage, detailed conditions etc, then where will it end? At what point will power users' requirements overwhelm and bamboozle casual users? Do we need a third screen where power users who have a need to differentiate secondary pillars from primary pillars, or who want a map of all curry stools which have not been found in the last six months, can drill down into the data as they wish?

Can the export option, e.g. from a search output, be returned? I found this very useful in order to add KML files to Google maps.

Definitely on the ToDo list... but I want the filtering functionality to mature a bit first.

On the map can more options be included for the filtering of the trig points in addition to pillar, major, minor and intersected? For example, primary, secondary, active, passive, etc.

Filtering on the map screen is actually quite hard, and I've not yet worked out how to get both flexibility and performance. For example, you'll notice that the county filters that I added this morning change the results list in /trigs, but in the /map screen there's no additional filtering, just an extra overlay layer.
So, regardless of the above discussion about filtering, implementing it on the /map screen may be a "no" from a technical competency perspective!

On the map can the maker for a trig point have the option for a different shape rather than just the TPUK logo? For example, a dot or cross.

Ah, but where will it end? Give the users configurable icons and next thing you know, they'll be demanding a Dark Mode!

On the page for each trig point the latitude and longitude is WGS84 and not just WGS. Out of curiosity what transformation is used for converting from OSGB36 to WGS84?

tl;dr: no idea!

Regarding the base data... the original spreadsheets I used for populating the pillars came with 10 fig OSGB grid references, but I have no idea of their provenance. The passive station database records were scraped from the OS website (with permission). Both these datasets were converted into ETRS89 using the OS website's bulk OSTN02 conversion tool.

Over time, user-added trigpoints accumulated, whether they were filling holes in the original data loads, new active stations, or Irish trigpoints. Coordinate conversions for these used a basic Helmert transform between the different systems.

On the new website, distances are calculated as great circle distances between WGS84 coordinates, rather than straight-line distances on the OSGB grid. So if you enter an OSGB grid reference in the search box, it'll first convert to WGS84 using a basic Helmert transformation.

At some point, I may grab the latest OSTN15 rubber-sheet transformation and have a clean up of any records where official OSGB documentation exists. But for the majority of the records we have, I genuinely have no idea where the numbers came from. I've merely tried my best not to make them any worse!

Will trig tools be returning as some of the functionality was useful. For example, percentage of trig points in a county or of a certain type logged was valuable.

I do hope so! I had a chat with Barry before the migration to discuss options. Some of the functionality, such as photo scores, might be added into the core codebase. But as for the data-mining aspects, it all hinges on the answers to the questions you asked above. I'm reluctant to over-complicate the /trigs and /map screens with too many knobs and buttons; but I also recognise the need for the site to have utility and interest beyond planning this weekend's walk! A dedicated area, where UX can take a back seat to functionality, seems a perfect solution!

[Teasel]

No problem, thanks for responding anyway. Counties were always a bit of a problem as they weren't the historic counties and threw up a few issues.

Historic counties, and recent administrative county / unitary authority boundaries, are now available to filter by on the /trigs list page, along with landranger and explorer map extents. I wasn't able to directly filter by county etc on the /map page, but the new "map" link on the list page will cause the boundary of the filtered area to be displayed.

I've not yet found a shapefile source for the pre-1995 administrative boundaries, so none of the above bears any relation to the values that are shown in the trigpoint details pages. I'm still evaluating the options for improving this, but in the meantime expect inconsistency and confusion over what the word "county" means (so what's new?!)

[ted1]

Hi Ian,

(Thanks for the Python API code btw, very useful)

Is there (or will it be reinstated) a 'flag this trig for the attention of admins' option?
I couldn't see one.

Thankfully, the login issues haven't ended up like
https://xkcd.com/3175/

[TrigJS]

Hi Teasel, thanks for your detailed response.

Definitely on the ToDo list... but I want the filtering functionality to mature a bit first.

Enhanced filtering and searching with the ability to export would be at the top of my wish list!

All your efforts with TPUK are much appreciated. Have you considered a Patreon, Kofi or something similar so users can thank you? I would certainly like to contribute in order to acknowledge your dedication.

Many thanks again, James

[BasilDowl]

No problem, thanks for responding anyway. Counties were always a bit of a problem as they weren't the historic counties and threw up a few issues.

Historic counties, and recent administrative county / unitary authority boundaries, are now available to filter by on the /trigs list page, along with landranger and explorer map extents. I wasn't able to directly filter by county etc on the /map page, but the new "map" link on the list page will cause the boundary of the filtered area to be displayed.

I've not yet found a shapefile source for the pre-1995 administrative boundaries, so none of the above bears any relation to the values that are shown in the trigpoint details pages. I'm still evaluating the options for improving this, but in the meantime expect inconsistency and confusion over what the word "county" means (so what's new?!)

Thank you for this - it is a sensational update and timesaver, thank you!

The only 'bug' I can see now is that the map isn't filtering out trigs I haven't logged - selecting that grey icon pulls up every trig I've logged or not.

Again, thank you Ian!!!!

[stripytrigger]

It already is! https://github.com/TrigpointingUK
As you will notice, it is itself mostly vibe-coded slop

There's a big difference between 'AI-assisted coding' and 'vibe coded slop' and I've no doubt the code here is the former

Thanks for pointing out the github repo (for some reason I didn't even think to go looking for it) - once things have settled down following the re-write, I'll try to remember to consider fixing issues rather than simply reporting them.

download search results

Definitely on the roadmap, but what should it look like? Way back when https://trigpointing.uk/photos/1 there was a need to be able to download the 25 nearest unfound pillars in memorymap format. But what's needed for today's audience?

I might be an edge case, but for me there's two use cases:

• what you said - i.e. downloading the pillars in an area that I'm going to visit but might not have much phone reception to browse them 'live'
• downloading the entire database for import in to another mapping tool (with the recent mapping improvements on T:UK I suspect this one is only relevant to very few users who want to combine this dataset with another)

[Teasel]

I've added a distance filter to the trigpoint list, and also had a first stab at a download feature.
Times have changed, so I've gone for [CSV, GeoJSON, KML, GPX] as the initially supported formats, but more can be added if necessary.
To avoid the site being flattened by bots, you'll need to be logged in. There are also daily per-user limits, to stop the cleverer bots. Let me know if I've set the limits too low and I'll work something out.

[eon1]

Hi Ian,
Loving the new site and getting used to it's ways now!
Apologies if this has been mentioned previously, but I do find myself missing the feature that allowed you see what days you had been out on and what trigs you had logged on each trip. Along with the monthly and yearly totals you had achieved. Would something like this be making a return?

Iain

[Teasel]

I've found myself unexpectedly missing the "recent logs by area" feature, so I could have a nosy at any logs in my parish... is there an easy way to do that at all? Otherwise the entire upgrade is fabulous, I can't thank you enough Ian.

I've added a filter at the top of the /logs page, which should enable you to restrict the logs shown to those within a given distance of a chosen point, and filter by type and whether you've logged it yourself etc.